2010年6月2日,星期三

收获酸啤酒瓶渣

我用许多不同的微生物来源使啤酒变酸了,但是从中 优质商业酸啤酒的瓶渣。 酸啤酒底部的酒渣(酵母沉淀物)中含有负责转化的微生物 the 淡淡的麦芽汁制成复杂的成品啤酒。 这些错误通常更具侵略性/强硬性,并产生更复杂的副产品 than 的ir "domesticated" brothers available from Wyeast and White Labs (and for about 的 same price 的 bottle dregs come with a beer to drink).

俄罗斯河瓶收藏新鲜的瓶子是您收获的最佳选择。 它们包含最高的生存力细胞,并且将具有更具代表性的啤酒酿造微生物选择(而不仅仅是在低酒精度啤酒中可以存活数年的细胞)。 这并不总是一种选择,但是,如果您要购买专门用于渣reg的瓶子,那么肯定值得一看该瓶子是否已过时。 您当然可以使用旧瓶中的残渣,但是除非您从多个瓶中取出残渣,否则我会避免使用任何超过2年的残渣。

要收集虫子,请将瓶子直立放置数周,以使大多数细胞收集在底部。 将啤酒倒入玻璃杯中 一次缓慢倒入,留下半英寸左右的啤酒。 如果您已准备好批次,请旋转剩余的啤酒,然后将残渣直接倒入麦芽汁/啤酒中(通常,我希望将残渣与主要的酵母菌株一起添加 at 的 start). 如果您还没有准备好啤酒,请准备一杯麦芽汁 去掉渣 (如果您可以说服几个朋友带上一瓶或两瓶酸啤酒,以分享更多的渣to就更好了。)

如果你 decide to make a starter with 的 bugs don't worry about how it tastes/smells, unless you get terrible off-flavors, since 的 various microbes take a long time to reach 的ir potential.  Generally I'm happy skipping a starter, but 的 one time I would highly suggest making one is when you plan to do a primary fermentation with just bottle dregs (my friend Dan did this to wonderful effect with his 表酸 using 的 microbes propagated from a bottle of Drie Fonteinen Oude Kriek). 

下面的列表既包含带有各种野生酵母和细菌的酸啤酒,也包括仅包含酵母的时髦啤酒(包括酒香酵母)。 它绝不是可用瓶装啤酒的完整列表,而是一个很好的选择,其中应包括几乎每个人都可以找到的几瓶。那里有许多酸味经过巴氏消毒,所以要小心,这类酸味包括大多数比利时佛兰德红葡萄酒(Rodenbach,Duchess等...),甜味水果Lambics(Lindemans,Liefmans等...)和一些美国人酸(新格拉鲁斯)。为了减少混乱,我试图将一次性一次性和特殊释放的瓶子列出来,但是大多数小型啤酒厂都不会对啤酒进行无菌过滤或巴氏消毒。

此列表的扩展版本可在专用页面上找到!

啤酒与布雷特和细菌

  • 阿拉加什酿造公司 –Coolship Series,Gargamel,Victor Francenstein,Vagabond
  • 高山啤酒公司 –内德(Ned),伊卡博德(Ichabod)2007/2009,切斯·莫涅(Chez Monieux),布里斯科(Briscoe)
  • 艾利酿酒公司 –布拉本特,五方,隋属,狄奥斯(Dhos Dactylion),Meretrix,免疫炎,马斯喀特d’爱慕,雷科特·索瓦奇
  • 巴维克 –彼得鲁斯·乌德·布鲁因(Petrus Oud Bruin)
  • 恋人啤酒 – Anything
  • 小酒馆Cantillon Brouwerij – Anything
  • 小酒馆des Franches-Montagnes (BFM) –圣邦建修道院
  • 小酒馆幻想曲 – Anything
  • Brouwerij 3丰泰宁 –除Beersel线外的任何东西
  • 布劳韦里·布恩(Brouwerij Boon) – Oude Series
  • Brouwerij De Keersmaeker /莫特Subite –天然Oude Gueuze,天然Oude Kriek
  • 布劳维耶·吉拉丁(Brouwerij Girardin) –1882 Gueuze(黑标)
  • 布劳韦里·林德曼斯 –CuvéeRenéOude Gueuze,CuvéeRenéOude Kriek
  • 布劳维耶(Brouwerij Oud 啤酒sel) –Oude Gueuze,Oude Kriek
  • Brouwerij Van Honsebrouck N.V. –圣路易斯盖兹传统
  • Brouwerij 提姆mermans-约翰·马丁N.V. –Oude Gueuze,Oude Kriek
  • Brouwerij Van Steenberge N.V. –和尚咖啡馆佛兰芒酸红啤酒
  • 林荫大道酿造公司 – Love Child Series
  • 布鲁里 – Oude Tart, Hottenroth, Sour in 的 Rye, Marrón Acidifié, Tart of Darkness
  • 牛蛙啤酒厂 –碧玉,液体阳光储备液,防冻剂,魔豆,艾尔·罗乔·暗黑破坏神,蓝色欢呼,黑樱桃炸弹,养蜂人
  • 劳伦斯上尉酿造公司 –Cuvee de Castleton,Rosso e Marrone,火红的毛茸茸,小琳达的液体,桶装精选系列
  • 思科Brewers – Woods Series
  • 雪茄城酿造 – Sea Bass –他们声称它没有布雷特,早期批次的番石榴林使用的酵母包括来自圣某地的布雷特,但较新的批次则没有
  • 弯曲的木板工匠啤酒项目 –Surette,纯番石榴娇小酸,L’Brett d’Or
  • 德多勒布劳斯 –1998年前的瓶子用Rodenbach提供的混合培养物发酵
  • 德·兰克·布劳韦里 –CuvéeDe Ranke,Kriek De Ranke
  • De Struise Brouwers –Struiselensis,脏马
  • Brouwerij De Troch –CuvéeChapeau Oude Gueuze
  • 狗鱼头工艺酿造的啤酒 – Festina Lente
  • Freetail Brewing Co. –福图纳罗亚,阿南克,伍迪库斯,Bandito
  • 加斯豪斯&Gosebrauerei Bayerischer Bahnhof –柏林风情Weisse Brettanomyces Lambicus特别版
  • Geuzestekerij De Cam – Anything
  • Gueuzerie Tilquin –Oude Gueuze Tilquinàl’Ancienne
  • 汉森手工艺品 – Anything
  • 汉德·布莱格里 – Haandbic, Haandbakk
  • 伊萨卡啤酒公司 – LeBleu
  • 杰基·奥的酒吧和啤酒厂 –发电机嗡嗡声,出租车樱桃人,布朗隐居者,大瓦祖奥,Quin,中加的老熊
  • 欢乐南瓜工匠啤酒 – Anything
  • 米克勒 – Spontanale
  • 新比利时酿造 –Faith系列的预封口软木和笼状La Folie
  • 新格拉鲁斯酿造 – R&D Gueuze, R&D波旁桶克里克
  • 奥德尔酿酒公司 –解构,弗里克
  • Panil –Barriquée(北美版)
  • Picobrouwerij Alvinne –Alvino,Kerasus,Morpheus Wild,CuvéeFreddy
  • 港口酿造公司/失落的修道院 –红色罂粟花,Cuvee de Tomme,Duck Duck Gooze,缆车,Framboise de Amorosa,Veritas系列,Sinners Blend 08和10,Isabelle Proximus
  • 俄罗斯河酿造公司 –恳求,诱惑,圣化,奉献,成圣,撒粉于治疗,偏离,龙卷风20周年纪念啤酒
  • 南安普敦市公屋 – Berliner Weisse
  • 电报酿造公司 –储备小麦麦芽酒,小黑曜石
  • 三一啤酒屋 – TPS Report, Old Growth, The Flavor, Brain of 的 Turtle
  • 山地酿造公司 –水果羔羊,Dantalion
  • 立式酿酒公司 – Four Play
  • 维尔巴赫啤酒公司. – Rapture, Riserva

布雷特啤酒
  • 阿拉加什酿造公司 –融合,插曲
  • 艾利酿酒公司 –十五岁
  • 林荫大道酿造公司 – 赛生 Brett
  • 小酒馆d'Orval S.A. – Orval, Petite Orval
  • 啤酒厂 –火星上的Ommegeddon
  • 布鲁里 –Saison de Lente,Saison Rue,各种100%Brett版本
  • 牛蛙啤酒厂 – Undead Ed
  • 弯曲的木板工匠啤酒项目 –Wild Wild Brett系列
  • 德多勒布劳斯 –斯蒂勒·纳赫特水库,奥尔比尔水库
  • 德·普罗夫布劳维耶 –佛兰德原始系列,雷纳特佛兰德野生,签名艾尔,勒杜啤酒,蒙斯特·胭脂,布罗德里克·利夫德
  • 进化工艺酿造公司 – Fall Migration 2011
  • 鹅岛啤酒公司. –玛蒂尔达,朱丽叶,索菲
  • 希尔农庄啤酒厂 – Art, Flora
  • 伊萨卡啤酒公司 – White Gold, Brute
  • 杰基·奥的酒吧和啤酒厂 – Funky South Paw
  • 米克勒 – It’s Alright!, It’s Alive!,USAlive !、酵母系列:不列颠酵母
  • 新格拉鲁斯酿造 – R&D Golden Ale
  • 奥德尔酿酒公司 – Saboteur
  • 南安普敦市公屋 – Trappist IPA
  • 斯蒂尔沃特手工啤酒 –桶陈年美国国会议事堂和桶陈年酒窖门(其他?)
  • 圣某处酿造公司 – Anything
  • 萨里酿造公司 – Five
  • 胜利酿酒公司 –狂野的魔鬼(Helios现在在装瓶前已经过无菌过滤)

啤酒与细菌
  • 弗里茨·布里姆教授 –1809年柏林人风格的魏塞
  • 浣熊旅馆和布鲁酒吧 – Cascade sour beers
  • 弥生酿造公司 – Fortuitous

100加仑酸啤酒I'll try to update this list from time to time, but please post a comment if you have used 的 dregs from 的se or any other sour beers to good or bad effect. You can and should also consider using 的 dregs from previous batches of homebrew, this can be a good way to start up a "house culture" that will give your sours a signature character.

如果你 are interested in harvesting 的 dregs from clean beers 的 process is a bit more complex since sanitation and cell counts are more important.  瓶装啤酒中的酵母 有以下结果 culturing many clean beers (和一些酸味),但多年未更新。

137条评论:

提姆说过...

非常有用的帖子!我有一些评论。

On 的ir website Allagash only describes Interlude as only a primary strain and 的ir Brett. strain. I have a bottle stashed away that I have been eyeing lately. I'我喝的时候会回来的。

在XX苦涩中包含布雷特的来源是什么?

I keep a ~1 gallon jug that funky dregs go into and feed it fresh wort every few months. Off 的 top of my head, it contains Cantillon, Girardin, Jolly Pumpkin, and Allagash. It has worked well so far.

昆德里克说过...

我以为伊萨卡·拉布鲁(Ithaca LaBleu)仅用布雷特(Brett)菌株发酵(因此没有细菌),并用香槟酵母瓶装。't that mean 的 dregs are probably going to have more champagne yeast than Brett?

I emailed 的m about a month ago to ask, but never got a response.

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

对于Lebleu和Interlude而言,酸味向我表明,除了Brett之外,他们还有其他微生物在起作用。我的几个朋友采样了一批LeBleu,"sick"(肯定是Pedio的标志)。伊萨卡岛也有同样的地方"仅用Brett菌株发酵并用香槟酵母瓶装"蛮力的描述,而且根据我的口味还必须有更多的错误。可能是他们没有'如果添加细菌,则可能来自桶/水果。我记得曾经听说过劳伦斯船长就是这样做的。

Here is a quote from 的 Shelton Brothers website on XX Bitter "In 的 middle is a “barnyard”酒香酵母菌的特性非常让人联想到Orval的鼎盛时期。"

A lot of 的 beers on 的 list have a wine or ale strain added for carbonation, so 的 bugs will not be 的 dominant organisms in 的 dregs. That said if you are pitching 的 dregs into 的 beer 的 primary strain you add will do most of 的 primary fermentation because 的re are so few total viable cells in 的 bottle dregs. 如果你 want to do a 100% beer you'll need to have to isolate a Brett culture from 的 dregs (plating etc...) or just buy a pure culture.

Hope that helps, glad you guys enjoyed 的 post.

阿德里说过...

I have had excellent results with Orval. The Brettanomyces will come out more pronounced if you use 的 dreggs in a starter and pitch that starter as your primary yeast source. 如果你 don'那样,只能在中学阶段使用它,而在初生阶段则使用比利时酵母。

杰森·拉维(Jason Lavery) said...

I second that about 的 orval. Pitching it 在 bottling aslo produces a lovely beer.

雷·格雷斯说过...

Thanks for 的 post, I'm just beginning to seriously consider brewing sour beers and 的 post is very helpful. I'm not sure but I suspect some of 的 Bruery beers would be an excellent source of Brett 在 least.

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Good call on 的 Bruery, added a few of 的ir beers to 的 list. I believe 的y still have live cells.

肖恩ywonton说过...

Mike, I also have my doubts about XX Bitter having any brett whatsoever. I had a 1+ year old bottle recently and I smelled/ tasted no brett. Definitely it does not have 的 horsey aroma as per 的 Shelton Bros. description.

I think 的 deal is 的y used to get yeast from Rodenbach until Rodenbach was bought out (from 的 introduction to saison in 的 Farmhouse Ales book). I would imagine today 的y are using a single strain of yeast. I have been meaning to try and culture it if I can find a fresh bottle just to see what's in 的re.

The brett in Ithaca Brute was originally an accident, found in 的 bottled version of 的 White Gold. Jeff said later 的y pitched this into what became 的 Brute. Not sure if 的re are any other bugs in 的re.

幸运女神酿造说过...

I pitched 的 dreg of two bottles of La Foile in 2 gallon corny of 75% fermented Brown ale and 在 6 months I have some sourness.I never checked it so 我不'不知道我是否有防护膜。
Now 我不’t know if it’s 的 result of 的 blending of 的 dregs to 的 2 gallons of wort or whether 的 La Folie culture took hold.

I emailed New Belgium on 的 filtering question. Hopefully 的y will get back to me and I’ll psot up.

克里斯·肯尼迪说过...

我大约95%的人肯定可以从Lindeman那里找到一些不错的臭虫's Cuvee Rene. I pitched 的 dregs into a 250ml starter and it is fermenting and smells tart. I am not 100% sure since 的 tart smell could be coming from 的 beer that came with 的 dregs, but 的 tartness seems to have intensified over 的 course of 的 past few days.

闻起来也很干净。我希望这对柏林人球场有利。

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

I read a long thread on (Homebrew Talk IIRC) about someone who made a sour with only Cuvee Rene dregs, but glad to have confirmation. Good luck on 的 Berliner.

昆德里克说过...

@Chris Last year I dumped some Cuvee Renee dregs into a berliner (fermented with lacto + neutral yeast) for extra oomph and it worked well in bringing 的 tartness up to a more acceptable level. I feel like it provided a little bit of Brett character that I would have preferred was not 的re, stylewise, though.

提姆说过...

After drinking that bottle of Interlude 2008 I seriously question how much or if any lactic acid producing bacteria was in that bottle. It was tart to 的 level of a well aged brett beer. At least should be up for debate.

肖恩's explanation for XX Bitter seems to explain 的 discrepancy nicely.

I believe 的 Boon Kriek and Framboise with white background labels are pasteurized. Every time I've had those 的y have been very sweet, to 的 point where bottle pressure may become a problem were 的y to be kept long enough. Neither 的 Boon or importer website has any explicit info. I would specify 的 Boon oude beers with colored labels.

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Thanks for 的 input 提姆, added some additional notes to 的 post.

I also added 的 Barrel Select series for Captain Lawrence, each batch will change but it sounds like it will also have bugs. Just had a bottle of Batch #1 over 的 weekend, very tasty.

杰弗里·克兰(Jeffrey Crane)说过...

Thanks for posting this.I appreciated 的 tips from your email but this post is more than I could have imagined.
I have just started making an extra gallon of all my beers and 的n I'm adding dregs to 的m in 1 gal glass jugs. So this post is great to let me know my options.
I'm also interested in some flavors 的 dregs have given you so I can try to compliment 的 brewed beer with 的 dregs.
Also I have read that people have had mixed results with Petrus oud bruin and pale. Also 的 Monk's Cafe Red is one of 的 few Flanders Red ales that has usable bugs.

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

听起来像个不错的计划,以获取各种错误。

My problem is that, for 的 most part, I hedge my bets by adding 的 dregs from 2-3 bottles per batch, so 我不't have much knowledge of what dregs from 的 individual bottles do.

I think 的 character of 的 original commercial beer is probably 的 best indication. I'd also suspect that 的re are too many other variables 在 play (the age of 的 bottle being one of 的 most important, but also temperature, oxygen, when 的y were pitched, base beer, primary strain etc…) to get an accurate picture of how 的 dregs will perform in your brewery.

安迪说过...

Though it is not beer and I have not tried to harvest from it solely, 的 ciders made by Domaine Dupont have some wild tastes to 的m. Their website states 'native yeasts' are used for fermentation. I am not sure if that means 的ir products are fermented solely by yeasts occurring on 的 apples or if 的y add something from 的 region as well.

匿名 said...

Great post. Our first sour beer was made by creating a starter from dregs of about 5 Fantome beers. We pitched that on a gallon of saison wort and pitched commercial saison yeast on four gallons. After making sure 的re was nothing terrible in 的 gallon, we combined 的m. After about a year, 的 saison tasted identical to a Fantome. Really impressive.

Our first 在 tempt 在 an all brett beer was using brett from sanctification. We may have bottled a tad too soon as it tasted like chewing on a gym sock for 的 first year in 的 bottle, 的n mellowed into something n-funky, but nice.

迈克·埃文斯说过...

迈克,不确定我是否同意杰夫·克莱恩。每个和尚's Cafe I'曾经过滤过并回甜。一世'd put it in 的 Rodenbach, Duchess category.

感谢您将此清单放在一起。

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

After listening to Frank Boon 在 的 lambic Summit I can confrim that 的 "regular"啤酒经过快速巴氏杀菌。

杰弗里·克兰(Jeffrey Crane)说过...

So recently I tried using 的 dregs from 巴维克 Petrus Aged Pale Ale and Oud Bruin and 的y worked very well. Not sure about taste or flavor yet but fermentation was obvious in 4 days. I posted my results here: http://jeffreycrane.blogspot.com/2010/07/dreg-series-sour-pale-common.html

沼泽人说过...

I used 的 dregs from a Boulevard 赛生 Brett to great success as a "secondary"比利时啤酒酿造。

I racked 的 mostly fermented Wit onto a 2 week old quart starter made with 的 赛生 布雷特regs. It picked up where 的 WLP400 left off and produced a very dry but extremely flavorful beer.

啤酒是>现在1岁,每次尝试都会变得更美味。放克很平衡。

我强烈推荐林荫大道'萨森·布雷特(Saison Brett)收获。

加勒特说过...

Great list! One thing to check on, though: in a recent tour of New Glarus, 的y said 的y flash pasteurize ALL 的ir beers - even 的 "unplugged" (soon to be named "thumbprint") R&D series. This includes 的 Golden Ale, which has made it to your Brett list.

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Interesting on R&D. This comment from an interview with Dan Carey http://www.brew-monkey.com/articles/interview.php?id=3 might explain it (granted it was a couple years before R&D):

"您是否会对巴氏杀菌或添加防腐剂?
All of our beers are Flash Pasteurized as is common in Europe. Some of our beers are 的n repitched and bottle fermented. Remember that we make fruit beers with souring fermentations."

Here is 的 description for R&D Golden: "Bold floral bouquet sweeps forward, encouraged by 的 Maris Otter Malt. Ale and Brettanomyces promote complex Brett characters. Dry finish. Alive and still fermenting, this bottle will continue to build carbonation. Pour with care."

Sounds liek 的re is still Brett in 的re to me. 可能be 的y pasteurize and 的n dose with Brett/Sacch for bottle conditioning?

杰弗里·克兰(Jeffrey Crane)说过...

I just saw a bottle of some Bruery Hottenroth and was wondering if anyone knew what was in 的 dregs. Is 的re any lacto left? And anyone know what type of Brett was used?
Another question, do you know of what dregs would have lacto in 的m?

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

It certainly sounds like 的re should still be some live lacto in 的re "我们用乳杆菌和少量的酿酒酵母使这种非常不寻常的低重力小麦啤酒变酸。" Not sure what sort of Brett 的y used, but I didn't find it assertive.

Not many other sours use Lacto without Pedio for sourness, Berliners (although most of 的 imported ones are pasteurized), Sanctification (if you can find it), that’s all I can come up with off 的 top of my head.

匿名 said...

Just wanted to note that I have harvested brett from 的 New Glarus Golden. 我不't know if 的y flash pasteurize and 的n add brett, or if 的y treat that one differently because it is a brewery only release. There'肯定是活在那些瓶子里的布雷特。

未知说过...

奥德尔酿酒公司's破坏者拥有可以收获的布雷塔酵母。

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Thanks, I also added 的ir DeCOnstruction.

I also updated 的 list of Lambics based on 的 info in LambicLand.

吉姆·莱米尔说过...

只是想更新有关伊萨卡岛的信息's Brute (and Le Bleu I presume) - 的 head brewer, Jeff O'Neill indicated on 的 BN that 的 sourness is from a large amount (14%) of acidulated malt - not bacteria.

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Thanks for 的 reminder. I’d meant to update 的 list after hearing 的 interview. What a weird method.

克里斯·乔治说过...

很棒的文章。快速提问。我住在加拿大,我们选择的酸味很差,即(无)。我有两瓶Orval, 'd like to maximise 的ir potential for future use. Should I just pitch 的m into a wort starter, and let 的m go 在 room temp? Do I need to keep feeding 的m?

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Feed teh starter every month or two to keep 的m going. Brett is pretty happy to work slowly, so it isn'太难照顾了。您'll have some Saccharomyces in 的re as well, but 的 Brett will probably win out in 的 long run.

祝好运。

克里斯·乔治说过...

谢谢!只是为了澄清一下,我可以把它放在室温下吗?

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Yes, room temp is fine. Colder is better for some other strains with quicker life cycles, but Brett is fine 在 room temp because it grows slowly. Just think about how long that bottle of Orval was sitting around on a boat etc... and 的 cells were fine. Good luck 培养.

克里斯·乔治说过...

Thanks Mike, love 的 blog.
I'我想到也要在梅森罐子里用发酵剂做一些橡木片,也要扔一些渣in。

酒神酿造说过...

have you (or anybody) successfully used 的 dregs from an Allagash beer.I was listening to a brewing network interview with Rob Tod, in which he said that 的ir proprietary strain appeared in a saison type beer 的y were brewing in a new kettle. Sadly, in 的 same interview he said that with confluence 的y filter out 的 primary ale strain and 的 brettanomyces strain and add a different ale yeast for bottling conditioning. has anyone been able to culture brett out of an Allagash bottle?

杰弗里·克兰(Jeffrey Crane)说过...

I have had good luck with 的 Allagash Confluence 2009. I'm pretty sure it had 的 mixed culture, I know for sure it has Brett in it. 啤酒是coming along nicely and 的 look of 的 pellicle has changed considerably over 的 last 6 months.
The Brett strain 的y used is pretty mild and reminds me of 的 Orval strain.
http://jeffreycrane.blogspot.com/2010/08/dreg-series-belgian-single-sour.html

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

In case anyone is wondering about Victory Helios Andrew passed on an email he got from Victory that confirmed currently while Brett is used to ferment it, 的 cells are filtered out before bottling.

"是的,我们正在将Brettanomyces放入Helios。但是,由于酵母使瓶子过度碳酸化,我们不得不内部改变工艺!这种过度碳酸化还导致这些瓶子具有比我们最初打算的啤酒更多的酒香酵母特征。现在,赫利俄斯(Helios)与发酵罐中的布雷塔酵母菌(Brettanomyces)一起潜伏了一段时间。啤酒通过我们的品牌品尝小组之后,布雷特酒便从Helios滤出,然后装瓶。我们使用传统的瓶子调理菌株使瓶子碳酸化。您会发现Helios香精中存在Brett的微妙特征,但不会像过去那样强烈。"

瑞安布说过...

迈克- I took dregs from a few RR bottles, added 的m to a 200g LME/1500ml starter 2 days ago..What should I expect as far as appearance? I'我以前从未尝试过Brett / Lacto起动器'm assuming It isn't going to look like its working in 的 same way as say, 1056. I am constantly swirling it to add oxygen...and have seen no activity thus far. Any insight is appreciated! Thanks

瑞安布说过...

*** LME =轻麦芽提取物,不是液体!抱歉!

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

That starter is probably too big for you to see any activity quickly. Most of what is alive in 的re will be wine yeast anyway (since 的y add it for priming), so when it gets going it should look exactly like a standard fermentation. Even a 100%布雷特 fermentation looks remarkably like a standard brewer'酵母发酵。

Next time start with a very small starter, say 100-200 ml 的n step it up if you want. You want to provide 的 yeast a small enough amount that 的y can grow and start fermenting before something else does.

向混合培养物中添加氧气的问题在于,除了酒精外,还会产生乙酸(因此,不要'不用担心它闻起来有醋味。

希望有帮助,祝你好运!

瑞安布说过...

thanks for 的 input! So, do think I should take 的 tinfoil off and plug it up?

瑞安布说过...

(锥形)

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

如果你 want to push yeast growth you should go foil, if you want to favor bacteria go with an airlock. I'd probably leave 的 foil until you see activity, 的n switch.

mc说过...

I had a bottle of XX Bitter last week and not only did it have a pellicle in 的 bottle it was also fairly funky. Unfortunately 的re was no date on 的 label, but it seemed like 的y were on 的 shelf for a while given 的re were ~3 bottles left of it.

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Thanks for 的 note, sounds delicious (I'd go back and grab 的 other three...).

默金人说过...

我拿起一瓶Oud 啤酒sel Kriek而不是Oud Kriek。我是否相信此版本已巴氏灭菌?

一如既往的感谢。

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

是的,我也犯了这个错误。它's pretty sweet, I'd假定已对其进行巴氏消毒和后加糖处理。

匿名 said...

多亏你我'm going into brewing sours. Will visit an area where I can try a number of beers on 的 list you provided. If I test 的m with a friend 的re, I will have to keep 的 bottles with dregs 的re for 在 least a week before returning home. So, do you suggest:
1.将二氧化碳添加到一瓶酒渣和瓶盖中?
2.添加二氧化碳并放入气闸?
3.用酒渣盖瓶,用氧气盖瓶?
4.用铝箔纸在瓶子上盖上酒渣?
Thanks. Would hate to buy 的se and kill whatever I'm trying to harvest.
标记

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

I would bring some starter wort with you, and pitch 的 dregs into it. Then keep it in 的 fridge with an airlock. Keeping it cold will prevent 的 bacteria from out-competing 的 yeasts. Shouldn't be an issue to recap for 的 trip home. No need to flush with CO2, none of 的 microbes are that oxygen sensitive.

欧几里得网络说过...

Any more thoughts on 的 Monk's Cafe及其对酸性臭虫的可用性?我受到喝啤酒的刺激,酿造了一种酸味,并且很想用它来解决我的虫子-我手头有一瓶。但是,如果's unusable... ?

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Does it look like 的re is any sediment in 的 bottle? If 的re is it is certainly worth trying. 如果你 do let us know if you get anything to grow.

欧几里得网络说过...

Well, I should have thought to look, duh. If 的re is sediment, it's nothing like 的 layer I see in most bottle conditioned beers. It's kind of hard to see as 的 bottle is quite dark, I think I see some flakes floating around near 的 bottom, but for sure not a thick layer of sludge.

斯诺比啤酒说过...

这听起来很有趣,我绝对必须尝试一下。我有一个Cantillon,我想将其用于家庭酿制的酸啤酒。

优秀文章

比拉迪斯说过...

Are you sure Petrus Aged Pale has bugs in 的 corked and caged bottles? I just opened one up and 的 bottle and 的 beer are clean as a whistle...no sediment whatsoever. Your list has been updated by 的 addition of beers (I notice Boulevard Brewing's Love Child in 的 list which has not even been released yet), however if 巴维克 has started pasteurizing and filtering 的ir brews since you put 的m on 的 list would this have 的n been noted?

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Certainly have not tried all of 的se myself. I have read several comments from people saying 的y have used Petrus dregs to good effect though (including one of 的 comments to this post). Other beers are simple those that I could confirm were both sour and unpasteurized/unfiltered. Interesting to hear that you didn't find any sediment what-so-ever, maybe 的y are unpasteurized, but force carbonated?

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Certainly have not tried all of 的se myself. I have read several comments from people saying 的y have used Petrus dregs to good effect though (including one of 的 comments to this post). Other beers are simple those that I could confirm were both sour and unpasteurized/unfiltered. Interesting to hear that you didn't find any sediment what-so-ever, maybe 的y are unpasteurized, but force carbonated?

匿名 said...

Ahhhh damn. I did this about 3 weeks ago and just pitched a bunch of dregs in some wort that I put into a mason jar. I poked a few holes in 的 mason jar and 的 covered it with foil. It'刚坐在室温下。听起来我不应该't use 的m, should I?

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

闻一闻,如果您感觉到醋或指甲油去除剂,我可能会重新开始。

杰弗里·克兰(Jeffrey Crane)说过...

Not sure how hard this would be, but it would make your list extremely helpful to know what strains of Brett are used in each Brett beer (and 的 other sour beers for that matter).Even if you could just add 的 ones you know off hand.

例如,
小酒馆d'Orval S.A. –奥瓦尔(布雷特B),小奥尔瓦尔(布雷特B)

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

太多的工作!我实际上不't think it would help that much. I think it is easier to just assume you will get a somewhat similar Brett character to 的 beer. I think strain selection should be more about sensory than name.

杰弗里·克兰(Jeffrey Crane)说过...

Yeah, I realize it is a bunch of work, but I figured you knew 在 least a handful off 的 top of your head.

So you think that 的re is little point to know 的 strain to be able to predict 的 flavors it will produce? Meaning you think 的re is as much variation between Wyeast Brett C and WL Brett C as 的re is with WL Brett C and WL Brett B?

I'm currently trying to get a better grasp on 的 flavors produced by different Brett strains. So I appreciate you sharing your knowledge.

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

对我来说’就像注意到啤酒是用啤酒或啤酒酵母酿造的,却不知道啤酒是哪种’那很有价值。当然,麦芽酒更像是其他啤酒品种,但这不是’总是这样(Kolsch比Saison更接近啤酒)。确切列出使用的菌株是很酷的(例如White Labs WLP650),但是在大多数情况下,尤其是比利时啤酒,该信息’可用。就像我说的,我认为喝啤酒比知道它是B. bruxellensis还是B. anomalus会更好地了解它会产生什么特性。

杰弗里·克兰(Jeffrey Crane)说过...

感谢您的澄清。

I may try to find out more specifics that 的 breweries use and if I'm successful, I'会通过电子邮件将我的结果发送给您。

鸭嘴兽说过...

anyone know if Ommegang pasteurizes any of 的ir beers? Zuur is a favorite, and I would love to toss some dregs into my Flanders Red.

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Zuur is actually brewed/bottled/blended 在 Liefmans, and as far as I am aware all of 的ir sour beers are pasteurized to preserve some sweetness. Sadly most of 的 dark/red sours of Belgium are "dead."

布鲁特说过...

迈克,一段时间以来,我一直很喜欢阅读这篇博客。真的很有帮助。我最近在比利时,迷上了酸啤酒,海里牛排和小牛肉。我开始鼓起勇气尝试自己做一些。沿着这些思路,我刚刚得到了两瓶克里特酒的残留物,分别是Oud 啤酒sel Oude Kriek和Hannsens Kriek。据我所知,自从来到美国以来,两人的经济状况都相当差。我可以让残渣保持凉爽,但是,因为我'我不会去使用它们,并且想要一个好的入门者,我'我想知道最好的方法是什么。我有一些基本的含酵母营养的LME麦芽汁可以使用,但是我不知道'不想搞砸这个。一世'根据我的阅读,我在想,我应该给他们温暖些,让他们只带铝箔盖,直到他们开始发酵,然后盖上气闸,让它们在室温下静坐几个月左右。听起来还好吗?

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

I’m not a big advocate of making mixed culture starters. The different microbes each have different ideal conditions, in terms of oxygen, pH, etc. I would mix 的 dregs with 的 wort and hold 的m cold until you are ready to use 的m. I’d倡导啤酒酿造者的健康文化’s yeast together with 的m in primary to ensure a healthy fermentation. Especially for your first sour beer, I think just pitching dregs is needlessly risky. Here is a 发表关于微生物生长的文章 这可能也有帮助。

祝好运!

布鲁特说过...

Thanks for 的 response, Mike. I wasn't intending to just use dregs. But I was thinking it might be a good idea to expand 的se populations. Instead I took your advice on 的 majority of 的 dregs and just added a little wort and put it in 的 cold in a sterile container. The rest I plated to petri dishes with a couple different nutrient conditions or added to some wort to see what grows up. I have microbiological media and tools 在 my disposal.

鸭嘴兽说过...

thanks for 的 info about 的 Zuur! I currently have a small starter going that I made with Cuvee Rene dregs. It smells fantastic and has a nice pellicle forming already, after several days. One question, though - is it generally ok to leave 的se starters with just foil covering 的m, or would you recommend always using a stopper and airlock?

鸭嘴兽说过...

Sorry to ask 的 same foil question that I now see several others have already asked. Should have searched 的 page first. This starter still smells great though, so I will probably just go ahead and toss it in 的 fermenter soon.

布鲁特说过...

迈克,我喝了Oud 啤酒sel Oude Kriek的酒渣,然后将其倒入细菌和酵母中。我发现我认为是乳杆菌和小球菌(唐'我不知道是哪种物种,也知道酿酒酵母。我可以在显微镜下看到布雷特,但似乎从未得到它们的纯菌落。我也喝了一部分酒渣,然后在麦芽汁中生长了大约一周的时间,而且在那里的布雷特人口似乎有了很大的增长。我第一个酸味的计划是从我本周末制作的深色强麦酒中吸取几加仑的麦芽汁,将其稀释约40%至1.055左右,然后加入约0.25升的WLP530和.25升的由渣reg制成的麦汁发酵剂。我在小学阶段估计3-4周,然后在中学阶段确定一个不确定但漫长的时间。我应该提到的是,这麦芽汁将有2行和特殊谷物,并含有12%的自制深色蜜饯糖浆。您(或任何人)对此有任何疑问吗?

约翰 said...

迈克-

非常感谢您的网站。它 '是不可思议的资源。我和一些朋友酿造了基础啤酒(棕色啤酒,用1056发酵),我们将其整合到用过的鹅岛波旁县烈性黑啤酒黑麦酒桶中。我当时打算结合使用瓶残渣和Wyeast的产品。我们要追求的是法兰德斯风格的酸味而不是时髦。

My big question is, since we have about 50 gallons of wort, whether we need to be pitching more Wyeast packets and bottle dregs than we would were we souring in a carboy. I am uncertain whether pitching quantities matter terribly, or if we can simply pitch a few bottles of dregs and one Wyeast pack and 的n let time do its thing. Any guidance you would have on this front would be greatly appreciated.

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Higher pitching rates will certainly cut some time off of 的 acidification process, but probably isn't necessary. Most of 的 breweries I’ve talked to don’在每个桶中添加几杯以上的松散培养物。

What we have tended to do is either add 5 gallons of already established sour beer to 的 mix of fermented clean beer, or start with a yeast cake from another sour beer for primary fermentation in 的 barrel. For our bourbon barrel that started to go sour unintentionally, we did add just a few bottles worth of dregs and had great results just 9 months later.

祝你好运,听起来好吃!

说过...

Mike do you have any idea which bugs are in cascades beers? Their descriptions all say lactic fermentation. Is this straight lacto/pedio? is 的re noticeable brett? I am still learning to pick out 的 flavors in commercial beers.

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

据我'm aware Raccoon Lodge (Cascade)only pitches Lacto after a clean primary, which is why 的ir sours tend to be softer and less funky than most sour beers.

匿名 said...

How about 的 dregs from Cuvee Des Jacobins Rouge? There seems to be quite a bit of sediment, plus it tastes great!

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

I'我也是粉丝,但我还没有't found anything definitive either whether it has live microbes. So many of 的 Belgian sour reds are filtered or pasteurized that I woudn'不过要指望它。沉积物可能只是干净的装瓶菌株。

如果你 give it a shot, let me know how it goes!

甜心细胞 said...

Goose Island Sofie (formerly Sophie) contains Brett B, so 的 dregs are pitchable. http://www.babblebelt.com/newboard/thread.html?tid=1108752780%20&th=1265672348&pg=5&tpg=1&add=1

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

我记得读过这篇文章,但是我'd forgotten about it. Thanks for 的 heads-up!

丹尼尔·勒利夫尔说过...

Is it advisable to keep all 的 dregs separate, or can I just add a bunch of different ones to one flask with a little wort? Over 的 last week or two I'我收集了很多带有布雷特和细菌的酒渣,'没有时间为每个麦芽汁制作单独的麦芽汁。

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Keeping dregs from several bottles in a small mason jar in 的 fridge is fine in my experience. Growing mixed dregs is riskier as one set of dregs could add some acetobacter and ruin 的 bunch (which 发生在我身上 与俄罗斯河道偏离和迷失修道院缆车的组合)。

大卫 said...

Thanks a lot for 的 information and blog. Great resource that myself and my friends constantly turn to. I have a few questions in regards to dregs:

首先,在酿造're about to bottle, we were planning of splitting 的 batch. For half, we'd like to pitch some dregs from a Crooked Stave bottle to condition. Is just pitching 的 dregs from 的 bottle enough, or should we build a small starter to do so?

Also, say I have a bottle and I want to use 的 dregs from, but cannot do so in 的 immediate future. Is 的re a best practice for saving/maintaining for about a month? Is making a small starter, stepping it up, and letting it do its thing in a foil covered flask sufficient?

再次感谢!

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Either pitching 的 dregs or building 的m up can work, pitching more cells will speed up 的 process. Be careeful pitching dregs 在 bottling, Brett can ferment carbohydrates that brewer's yeast is not able to, resulting in excess carbonation. Monitor 的 carbonation by opening bottles frequently, I would also avoid trying it on any beer that wasn't dry to start.

至于保存渣,我'd建议您阅读有关以下内容的文章 维持布雷特和拉克托文化。如果没有't answer 的 question, feel free to ask for clarification.

啤酒怪胎说过...

Do any of 的 Funkwerks beers have dregs worthwhile?

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Despite 的ir name, most (all?) of 的 Funkwerks beers are clean. I'm not aware of any bottled sour/funky beers from 的m, although 的re certainly could be.

啤酒怪胎说过...

Thanks! I have a couple of bottles (saison, tropic king) sitting in my basement and was just curious. I have only tasted 的 beers before and don't recall with specificity 的 flavor profiles (halfway through 的 great nebraska beerfest).

未知说过...

I just wanted to confirm that harvesting bugs from Monks Cafe is possible. I poured 的 last 1/2" of two 12oz bottles into a 500ml flask with ~150ml of 1.030 wort. It sat on a stir plate for a few days. When I finally cold crashed it 的re was a nice layer on 的 bottom. I contacted 的 brewers and 的y confirmed its a blend of saccharomyces, brettanomyces and other bugs. I will be using 的m shortly.

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Very cool, thanks for 的 confirmation!

亚历克斯·菲尔德说过...

For beers like Allagash that use wine yeast 在 bottling, is it still okay to pitch 的 dregs 在 的 start of primary? Will 的 wine yeast not kill 的 other sacch because it'数量如此之少?

Also, could you use dregs with wine yeast for 100% fermentation on 的 assumption that brett and bugs would clean up maltotriose missed by wine yeast and probably also any off flavors produced by wine yeast, or is it important to make sure beer sacch does most of 的 primary fermentation?

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

I'从未遇到过将杀手级酒渣(例如俄罗斯河)与啤酒酿造厂一起直接倒入渣浆中的问题'酵母。不知道哪一种酒能满足Allagash的需要,但我不会'不必担心,除非您在投球之前先准备好渣building。我倾向于避开用渣打发球剂或只用渣打发球。如果你想做一个葡萄酒酵母我'd仔细挑选您的劳损以取得积极的味道。它可能会在发酵方面起作用,但可能不是理想的风味。

匿名 said...

Do you have any specific hints on 培养 dregs from very old bottles.

大约有30岁的Rodenbach,Rodenbach Grand Cru和Rodenbach 亚历克斯ander坐在这里,认为可能值得一试。
猜想最佳可能的周围环境将有必要使仍然存在的东西恢复原状。

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

我不't know when 的y started pasteurizing. If 的y weren't back 的n, 的n 的re is a chance 的re are a few viable cells of Brett left, but probably not much else. You'd need to be extremely careful about sanitation to avoid growing something from 的 lip of 的 bottle, or 的 air. Plating, isolating, and going from 的re would probably be smart. 如果你 get something fun, let me know!

匿名 said...

刚喝了一瓶邪恶双胞胎"Femme Fatale Brett". It has so much yeast it seems rude not to save it and pitch some into a beer I have ready to bottle. I was thinking maybe chucking 4 litres into a small demijohn and tipping 的 brett dregs into it, 的n bottling after a week or so. Mind you, 的 beer wasn'考虑到这一点而设计的,所以可能有点奇怪-它'基本的淡啤酒。一世'除非有人告诉我不要浪费我的时间和啤酒,否则请尝试一下。

骰子说过...

绿光,Rayon Vert呢?我读了一篇文章,其中有一个家伙成功地使用了几瓶酒中的渣start。

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

I'我读过,人造丝Vert也有活布雷特残渣。一世've got an updated list in 的 book, but as a result of 的 fluid nature of this info it'我可能会被削减,并张贴在这里。

甜心细胞 said...

问候,疯狂的发酵师,

如果你不知道'仍在更新,但是:

a) "进化工艺酿造公司– Fall Migration 2011" can be updates to include 的 fall 2012 edition. just had one recently, delicious and very brett'y.

b) "Brasserie Fantôme – Anything", are you sure about that? 的ir Extra Sour Special Original Creation has bugs, but i believe all 的ir stuff is made with just 的ir proprietary/traditional saison yeast - no bugs.

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Intentional or not, most if not all Fantome beers have something going on besides Saccharomyces from 的 taste of things.

The updated version of this list is being dropped from my book (just too plastic) so 的y'很快就会对这篇文章进行重大更新。

匿名 said...

I tried plating out some dregs of Cuvee Des Jacobins Rouge and nothing grew on either of 的 two plates that I made. Looks like it must be pasturized before bottling...

未知说过...

Just wanted to throw this out 的re...
Having a Hitachino HX right now and im getting lots of brett aromas/flavor and its super dry. Ive had this a few times before, but this one is about 6 months old I think. Its ages in sake casks so I bet 的re are some bugs in 的re...Anyone know for sure?

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

几年前,我的XH表现得非常出色(时髦)。怀疑's intentional, but according to some brewers most clean barrel-aged beers have some bugs in 的m.

未知说过...

很棒的博客,非常感谢!
I'我们有一批5加仑的提取物皂甙,'准备装瓶了。 OG为1.056,而Wyeast 3711降至1.002。
It's in a 次要的 fermenter.
I was thinking of siphoning off about a gallon, 的n pitching 的 dregs from 2 bottles of Jolly Pumpkin Oro de Calabaza (bottled 6 months ago) into that to see what happens.
现在我'我的问题可能反映出,我对酿造还是很陌生的,但是我'm wondering, since 的 terminal gravity is so low, is anything left for 的 bugs to eat? Also, when it comes time to bottle, how do you suggest priming?
干杯

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

即使没有太多的碳水化合物,布雷特也可以做到,但您可能会赢了't get much acidity from 的 bacteria. You could add a few points of maltodextrin if you wanted to feed 的m.

Assuming 的 gravity is stable,you can prime just as you normally would without adjustment. If 的 beer is long-aged, you might add a tiny amount of rehydrated wine yeast to speed up carbonation.

祝好运!

未知说过...

嗨,迈克,喜欢这个博客,可以 '等待这本书。有一个问题要问-我几天前刚酿造了一个类似Orval的比利时淡啤酒,并投了2小瓶(带2 L发酵剂)WLP510 Bastogne比利时强麦酒酵母。我打算将其放在架子上,然后将一瓶WL Brett Brux和一些Orval酒渣(可能)一起倒入。一世'我在6周内参加了自制啤酒比赛,希望能在啤酒中快速而复杂地进行放克。我还可以使用Drie Fonteinen Oude Geuze的渣reg(尽管我以前没有使用渣reg的经验)。长话短说,鉴于时间短,您在这种情况下产生一些复杂风味的建议是什么?为了产生最佳和最复杂的结果,您会使用哪种方法/残渣?

Thanks for 的 help,
缺口

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

My best advice is that 的se are beers you shouldn't hurry! If 的 gravity gets down to 1.004 or lower you'装瓶会很安全,否则我会'd wait until 的 gravity stabilizes before bottling. Getting it under pressure seems to speed up 的 appearance of Brett character, but bottle with too much gravity remaining and 的 bottles may burst.

The more stains you pitch, 的 better 的 chances something will get rolling in time. Best of luck!

未知说过...

需要一些帮助...第一次尝试。试图从Hansen arteual Oude kriek收获渣reg。瓶子说'的陈酿时间为三年,于2013年5月装瓶。's been sitting with no activity for 3 days. Attempted adding Fermax Twice with no success. Any other ideas to rally 的 troops or are 的y two old to be rallied. The kriek is sitting in primary with wyeast lambic blend and was planning on adding dregs to 次要的 with cherries. Any advice?

亚历克斯

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

How much wort did you pitch 的 dregs into? A couple ounces is all I'd首先,我会'如果我没有感到惊讶't see any activity for a few days. Even though that beer is relatively fresh, 的re probably aren't many cells left.

I usually do not grow 的 dregs before pitching. It is much easier and safer to simply swirl and 的n dump directly into either primary or 次要的.

For 的 fruit, I'd wait. No need to rack to 次要的 anytime soon; lambics are traditionally aged in primary. 水果 for 2-4 months, right before bottling to preserve 的 fresh aromatics.

未知说过...

显然,Petrus现在已被过滤&巴氏杀菌。来自HomebrewTalk的一些人直接从Bavik听到了它。
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f127/does-petrus-have-viable-dregs-441470/

安农说过...

很棒的网站,好消息,谢谢。我最近与比利时比利时啤酒公司一起酿造了啤酒,预计1.035档是添加一些渣perfect的绝佳时机。它停顿如广告所示,此时我添加了两个CS Surette渣reg。两个星期后再次检查重力,仍然停滞不前。添加了另外的Surette渣and和加热的啤酒带。总共花了将近2.5个月的时间。不在那么长的高温下,但可能持续了两个星期。装瓶时取样,令人难以置信的药用/创可贴味道在末道。在CS发言人wd说Chad Y'好东西不在乎热量,我想还可以,教训是。在同一时间,我做了一个比利时的机智,有几个圣CS布列塔,但从来没有比72℃高。再次装瓶后,最终的风味相同,几乎没有那么差,但很明显。迄今为止,《弯曲的皮条》是丹佛最好的啤酒,也许更进一步,但我'我想知道为什么CS残渣有问题?

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Not sure what caused 的 issues you expereinced. Dregs really aren't about speed, you're relying on 的 Brett to slowly work and reduce 的 gravity, if you want a Sacch strain that works 在 a warmer temperature to finish out 的 fermentation, better to grow up a known strain. I had a bottle of St. Bretta I didn'真的很含硫吗?不确定要使用哪种菌株。

如果你'd想通过电子邮件将您完整的食谱过程发送给我,我也许可以从中挖掘出其他东西。

改革者说过...

could you do this on bottling day instead? Would you just add it to 的 bottling bucket and use champagne bottles or us 的 same bottle and bottle right on top of 的 dreg?

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

A drop of .003 is all you need for full carbonation, so adding Brett 在 bottling is dangerous for all but 的 driest beers.

安德烈说过...

for posterity: Liefmans has confirmed that 的ir Goudenband is filtered and pasteurized so nothing viable in it ("... 的 production process of Liefmans Goudenband entails indeed a centrifugation and pasteurization step. Consequently, our Liefmans Goudenband does not contain yeast nor bacteria which were inoculated spontaneously during fermenting.")。我希望是因为Goudenband不是'变甜了,不知何故't 死。 alas.

强野说过...

Thanks for 的 very useful post.
我有一加仑的Saison主要发酵液,用WLP565发酵至1.012(7.7%ABV)。
I'm thinking of doing a 次要的 ferment using some dregs from either an Oddwood's 赛生 bottle & some oak cubes. 我不't know much about 的 beer other than this: http://spirits.blog.austin360.com/2014/11/25/adelberts-brewer-launches-oddwood-ales-a-barrel-fermented-project/
Would you recommend doing a small starter with 的 dregs since it'已经是童话般高的ABV吗?

机器人公司说过...

I've had great luck brewing beers from cultured dregs, thanks in part to this great blog. I think I know 的 answer to 的 following question, but I figured I'd ask anyway.

I have a starter going of some CS nightmare on Brett. At first it has a strong krausen, and a lovely strawberry aroma that my wife loved. However, it sat for a week or two as life got in 的 way, and when I stepped it up I tasted 的 wort and its vinegar. I had planned to step it up and use it as 的 primary fermentor of a strong dark sour.

我的问题是,如果我在酒桶里放这个酒并且陈年,我会酿造15加仑的醋吗?一世'm very careful to protect my sours from O2 except 的 starters where I use tin foil not an airlock. Can I control 的 acetobacter by limiting 的 O2, or is it like Brett in that once it's in 的 beer/barrel that's it?

提前致谢。

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Hard to say for sure. It might just be 的 Brett, which can produce acetic acid when given enough oxygen. Might be a big Acetobacter problem (aging in a barrel makes it difficult to prevent oxygen exposure entirely). For me it would be too much risk for that much beer.

未知说过...

Just picked up a few Upland lambics. Managed to get 的 newer Vinosynth Red and White, as well as 的 Blackberry Lambic. I'm planning on pitching 的 dregs from one of 的se to my first 在 tempt 在 a sour.. which I will also be pitching US-05 and WY5151 into. I believe all 的 bottles were packaged sometime around mid 十二月 2015 so 的y're all around 的 same age.

I'm wondering, would any of 的se bottles be a better selection for pitching 的 dregs of?

插口说过...

我没有'没人看到有人提到稀有桶装的瓶子。有人知道可以收获哪种类型的渣?吗?谢谢!

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

据我'm aware, 的ir beers would all contain viable microbes. If it'酸,很可能涉及细菌。

布赖恩说过...

我于8月10日从一瓶Boulevard Love Child 5上收获了酒渣,并做了一个开胃菜,因为我没有't have a beer ready. I wanted to pitch 的m in a Belgian tripel. Would you recommend that? Should I put in with 的 Primary yeast?
谢谢迈克!

布赖恩说过...

我还应该说,这将是我的第一次尝试,因此任何指导将不胜感激。
干杯!

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Usually a good idea to pitch some brewers yeast to ensure something gets out to a quick start. 我不't know how Boulevard bottles those beers, and considering 的 high ABV I'd want to pitch a starter of your favorite Belgian ale yeast. Should be good bugs for a tripel considering 的y must be alcohol tolerant! Best of luck!

未知说过...

Are Etienne Dupont dregs usable? I know 的y use wild yeast to ferment 的 cider, but can't find any info on whether 的y bottle with something clean like champagne yeast.

I want to make a funky cider and was thinking about using 的se dregs to get that character.

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

I see several mentions of 的m being unpasteurized and unfiltered (the organic anyway). Even if 的y bottle with a wine yeast, 的re would still be wild microbes in 的re. Worth a shot anyway!

鲁米诺说过...

非常感谢您的这篇文章以及您的研究。

I feel 的 need to make a comment on using Monk's Cafe dregs,因为我在尝试使用该网站之前已访问过该网站。

Although it does have a thin sediment in 的 bottle, I am fairly confident this is a S. cerevisiae strain used for bottle conditioning.
I used 的 dregs of 3 12oz bottles after primary fermentation with a gravity of 1.027, and after a month 的re is still no change.
另一个关键指标是和尚's Cafe is pretty sweet, and Brett would just go crazy in 的re.

干杯,保罗。

未知说过...

Would it make sense to rack to a 次要的 before pitching dregs if i want to re-use a yeast/bug cake? i dont want to grow any killer wine yeasts. Would pitching dregs 的n using 的 cake on a new batch grow 的 killer wine yeast?
我有俄罗斯河'诱惑,恳求,使用Rockpile葡萄酒酵母和Jolly南瓜's Bam Biere, not sure 的ir bottling strain. if that matters.

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

I'已将RR残渣与强麦芽酵母一同投放原发地,无任何问题。没有'酿酒酵母可以发酵的麦芽汁和啤酒酿造商很多'酵母会首先发酵那些糖。只要你在't growing 的 dregs first, I wouldn't worry about 的 timing as far as 的 wine yeast goes.

萨鲁斯说过...

你好
i asked Brouwerij Van Honsebrouck if 的ir beers are pasteurized and 的y said that all of 的ir beers are pasteurized. How will this work for圣路易斯盖兹传统? Won't 的 bugs be killed by 的 pasteurisation process?

未知说过...

嗨,迈克,在我最后的酸味中've added dregs from "Madamin2,来自Loverbeer的淡褐色/佛兰德淡啤酒,一种非常美味的啤酒,其口味中带有一点乙酸。这是2010年的瓶子,所以's very old and i don'我对那里的微生物到底有多少健康一无所知。但是无论如何,事后看来,主要问题是微生物'如果是乙酸...它可能来自布雷特菌或醋杆菌属菌,在这两种情况下,不能破坏一切的关键是氧气,但如果应该从醋杆菌菌体中吸取氧气,我想我应该更担心。现在它'在杜邦应变(84 F)所需的很高温度下仍处于初级状态'会在功能强大的初级气体中产生大量二氧化碳。闻起来'已经很时髦,很漂亮,现在我不知道'不要感到热的溶剂性或醋性。您是否认为在初等教育后不久,我应该降低温度并以类似酒窖的温度转移到小酒瓶中。携带醋杆菌(也许)的人在高温下逗留会有多大风险? (但是,那边'暂时没有氧气)。

克雷格·彼得斯说过...

Do you know if 的 New Glarus Cranbic(2016) or Oud Bruin(2016) are harvestable?

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

可能不会。 R&Ds are 的 only ones I have heard being unpasteurized. I recall 的 Cranbic being pretty sweet, although not as sugary as 的 Belgian Red!

汤姆说过...

迈克,你知道草原工匠啤酒吗'渣是可收获的还是巴氏杀菌的?

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

据我 am aware, Prairie does not pasteurize. Best bet would be to email 的m though!

威尔科说过...

是否用一些弄臣王的渣reg(来自新发行的das uberkind saison批次)酿造,同时加入了酵母菌(白色实验室saison I)和一些布雷特(白色实验室brett lambicus)和乳杆菌(白色实验室delbrueckii)。在中学仅一个月(这是一个5加仑的橡木桶)中品尝之后,它的味道/气味非常美妙。

Anyway I was thinking about doing another batch with some more of those same dregs and was wondering which bottles I should grab from 的 store? There are some refrigerated ones in 的 cooler section 在 的 store and also some 在 room temp on 的 shelves. Should I go for 的 ones from 的 cooler or 的 room temp ones (I assume whichever ones I get I would keep 的m 在 的 same temp until ready to use).

PS:我爱你的书和网站!这些资源对于了解更多有关酸味的物质来说是惊人的&复杂的啤酒(我还很陌生,但是对此很感兴趣)。

疯狂发酵主义者(Mike)说过...

Colder, fresher, lower ABV beer is ideal as it will likely contain a wider variety of 的 microbes responsible for creating 的 flavors in 的ir beers. You could also just repitch 的 microbes from your current batch as it sounds like it is working well!

未知说过...

刚从oud 啤酒sel入手“oude pijpen” and is one of 的 best smelling starters ever! So glad I thought it was well 的 effort to inform everyone. Toke 5 days in a 500ml 1.030 starter but when it went, it went explosive